Season 4, Episode 4
David Wilcock: Hello, I'm David Wilcock, and welcome to another episode of “Cosmic Disclosure”. I'm here with Corey Goode, and in this episode we're going to get into government trolls, our friends we love to hate online who always are so willing to share their very, very negative and depraved opinions. But are they really just ordinary folks, or is there something more going on? So Corey, welcome to the program.
Corey Goode: Thank you.
David: I want to open this up by talking about a very, very bizarre television show that is now available. Anybody can watch it if they have a basic Netflix subscription. It's called “Ascension”. In the show “Ascension”, they describe a honeypot situation where, when people started to find out about this program that they're describing in the show, that there are places online that they designed where you will find that information. And they make it out like it's just a website, but then they're looking for people who actually are leaking real information. And that leads to a government hit job.
So is that aspect of what they say in the television show “Ascension”, is that real? Will they hang out information to see if a whistleblower shows up, and try to make them think that it's a trustworthy place to disclose data, only to find out that the trap is going to snap on them?
Corey: Yes. They use websites. They use people posting in forums, and they use established researchers who have been compromised by informants of their own. They've got the infiltration of this field down to a fine art, and they've had the infiltration of ufology in the esoteric community down from the beginning, since the early '50s.
David: How much of the information that people who are studying up on UFOs and reading online may be part of this type of program? Is this a fairly isolated phenomenon, or is it a fairly widespread phenomenon? How prevalent is disinformation in the UFO community?
Corey: It's incredible. It's heavily controlled, heavily manipulated information.
David: So what are we really looking at here? Does this mean that the average person, who feels like they've done a lot of homework and has really studied up and learned what there is to know about UFOs, are they polluted with an incredible amount of disinformation?
Corey: Oh, yes. I mean, I've talked to people who have angrily said, “I've done this for 40 years, 45 years, you know, 10, 15 years I've been studying this. I've been in the middle of it.” Their egos can't let them for a moment to believe that they have been tricked by information by these infiltrators.
David: Let's talk about the abduction issue for a moment. It's a very strange counterpoint between, for example, Dr. John Mack, who was a PhD psychiatrist from Harvard University – or it might have been MIT. I'm trying to remember. It's one of those two - the big Ivy Leagues in Massachusetts. Anyway, I think it's Harvard. Dr. John Mack, straight ahead mainstream psychiatrist with all kinds of published papers behind him, is interviewing people in a therapeutic context using hypnotherapy.
People get hypnotized, and they start to report extraterrestrial contact. And he writes a big, thick book just like mine – 500 page monster. You read John Mack's “Abduction”, and there's innumerable reports of people have been benevolent contact, spiritual experiences, mind-expanding experiences, prophecies of some sort of very positive change for humanity. And he said this seems to be a very consistent element of the contact experience.
Then, he allegedly slips on the ice and falls and hits his head, and he dies, right as UFOs are really starting to take off. But then you have almost every other alien abduction researcher completely divergent from what John Mack was saying – that abduction is this terrifying thing. It's only negative. They're bringing you up, they're taking genetic samples, they're terrorizing you, then they mind wipe you and send you back down.
So let's talk for a moment about the abduction narrative. Are these certain folks that are putting out very consistently negative information about abduction possibly on some sort of government payroll?
Corey: Not necessarily on a payroll, but are buying into a certain narrative that has been meticulously seeded with very believable information, and information that they know that a certain person is predisposed to want to accept.
David: Is it possible that there are people who are actually being paid to write books and pose as normal researchers?
Corey: Oh, yeah. That's definitely true.
David: Okay. I'm not going to name names, but I'm thinking of one very strongly right now.
Corey: Yeah, the most important tool to have is a psychological profile on a person. If you have a psychological profile on a person, you're able to then find ways to get into their life and manipulate them, manipulate their belief systems. You know what they're looking for, what their field of study, their interests are, and then you can put in people that have that information with the caveats that you've put on it, disinformation caveats, and then they jump on – or if they bite that information, then you are in with them and then they are now, I guess, parroting that information for you if you're a disinfo agent.
David: Well, let's talk about that psychological profile. You obviously know what you're talking about, but we don't. So let's just say you have someone on the Internet who has been targeted. What do you actually see, and what are they doing? What are they looking for?
Corey: Well, they have different types. They're going to break down your personality type.
David: What does that mean?
Corey: There are 16 main personality types. If you go and you take the test and you find out what you are, they have pages of pages that will describe your personality. Science has developed this personality typing over a long period of time.
David: I remember in college, I majored in psychology, there was something called the MMPI or the Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory. It was a very, very complex, multiple choice test that did crank out something like you're describing at the end.
Corey: Right. This is very similar.
David: Yeah, okay.
Corey: They've had a lot of these that have evolved over time.
Corey: So they want to find out your personality type. and most people think that everybody thinks the same way that you, that they, do, but we all approach things, think through things, differently. They want to get into your head and figure out how you think. Then, they're going to . . .
David: Is neuro linguistic programming part of this?
David: Okay. Then how does that factor in? Because I've heard that some people are more visual, some people are more auditory, some people are more . . . and you'll see people the way they look, like they'll move their hands, and where they look when they're talking about something has to do with what part of the brain they're accessing, that kind of thing.
Corey: Right. And they're going to need to know that type of information to know how best to target you. And then they're going to get as much information about the type of friends you keep, the type of content you watch on television, the type of information you follow on the Internet, the type of comments you make on social media – any and all information - they take, they put it together, and they have these different array of different types of psychiatrists that then pour over it and come out with a final psychological profile that says . . . It's a profile that an operative can look at and use to say: “This person will most likely behave this way in this scenario. Or if I want this person to behave this way, this scenario will most likely elicit this response.”
David: Well, I got pulled into jury duty a few times, and these attorneys end up asking everybody certain questions. And when they're trying to select a jury, obviously they want to pick jurors that they think are going to be more likely to win.
Corey: They're profiling you.
David: Yeah. So what is this . . . Is there a document? And is it like a stapled series of 8½ by 11 pages that you can flip through? How many . . .
Corey: Well, if you print it out.
David: Okay. So it's a written document.
Corey: Right. It's a typed document. It depends on what type of information they've been able to . . . If they've gotten into your medical records, they'll have medications that you're on. Sometimes if they want to get in and switch out your medications, that's handy to have. They want to know absolutely everything about you. So there will be medical information that's supposed to be HIPAA safe – everything that you can think of.
David: Well, one of the things we've heard over the years - I've been in this field a long time – when people are actually contacted by agents, which used to happen a lot more than it does now, and they actually do want to intimidate you, they will say things to you where you're like, “Wait a minute. I didn't tell anybody that. How the hell did you know that?”
David: So that gives them a lot of power. So they'll use all kinds of surveillance, and they want to have all these invasive personal details. So is it like an analysis of vulnerability? Is there a tactical breakdown of where somebody's vulnerabilities are? If you hit this button, you'll get them to break. If you hit this button, you can take away their money. If you hit this button, their relationship is going to fall apart. If you hit this button, their family's going to turn on them. If you hit this button, then this is where they go shopping and you could target their car while they're in the shopping mall?
Corey: Pretty much.
David: Wow! What's the tone in these documents? Is it sarcastic and mocking, or is it just very clinical and scientific?
Corey: It's clinical, scientific, matter-of-fact.
David: So it doesn't have a lot of nasty talking-down language or anything?
David: Okay. So let's get into the core of what I wanted to speak about in this episode, which is people online are in discussion forums and we've been watching this happen for a long time. I first started to go online with a 14.4 kilobytes-per-second modem dial up, which I didn't even realize went that high. I only did it at 4.4, 4,400. “Oh, my gosh, it goes up to 14.4.”
Corey: I remember.
David: And one of the first things I did is I went to Richard C. Hoagland's discussion forum on EnterpriseMission.com. And I'm saying, here's this guy coming out with this incredible stuff, that there's a monument on Mars.
David: It looks like a face, obviously artificial, with pyramids right nearby and a five-sided pyramid down at the bottom. NASA's got it on these photographs. There's all these geometric alignments that lead to a new physics of a tetrahedron inside a sphere. And this is where the Great Red Spot is on Jupiter, and this is where Hawaii is on Earth, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Wow!
And then I start reading this stuff, and why would these people be so angry and so aggressive? And over the years I started to notice, when you really get these nasty skeptics, they will never acknowledge that you made a point. They never change their mind. Their opinions never flex even slightly, and they just will constantly be on the attack.
And any rational, normal person, if you win a point, they will acknowledge and concede, “Yeah, yeah, that's true. Maybe I ought to be looking at this differently.” But these folks are like little fundamentalists, and all they do is they just caw and caw, like a raven, and they never get past their own opinion.
David: When people see folks like this online, are you saying that these people actually are being paid?
Corey: Not all. I mean, there's a phenomenon of anonymity, power. People feel powerful in anonymity on the Internet. They feel like, especially if they don't feel empowered in real life to stand up to people, they will overcompensate with the anonymity of the Internet. There are people that are narcissists and sociopaths that just get off on getting into circular debates.
Corey: So there is that. But I'm absolutely positive because I helped set up a government data center for, basically, government trolls.
David: You helped set it up?
Corey: Right, as an IT (I) set up a virtual data center to where each station had a post coming up, six monitors branching off, one computer station that ran VMWare workstation. And they'd pull up VMWare workstation, and they would pull up a virtual computer screen. It would be just like when you log on to your computer. You pull up a virtual machine, a virtual computer, but this computer could be on a server anywhere in the world and the IP address is anywhere, wherever that server is in the world.
So you can be sitting at this station and be pulling up these virtual machines from servers all over the world and make it look like you're in those locations from the IP address. And these people would have over a dozen different personalities that were created online, and had back stories, back information, have social media tied to them – very complex personalities set up with them.
And these operatives were normally what we call the “personality metamorph types”. It's a program of people that were sociopaths, really good liars and infiltrators, and were really sociopaths and were really good at this job.
And they would sit down. Some of them would just troll around looking for information. Some of them would be given targets, go to certain Internet forums – esoteric Internet forums – log on with three or four user IDs, and sit there and cause a huge disruption if they saw a topic that was legit or something they didn't want to be talked about, cause a big disruption and sit there and have an argument with their self. And it looks like it's three or four people, problem people, having an argument, when it's really the same person sitting at a computer using virtual machines from all over the world and using fake personalities with user IDs.
David: Well, you have people that show up on my site and you get a whole bunch of them that all appear at once, and they start making all these anti-semitic comments. And then if we allow those to go through, somebody could then say, “Well, David is hosting anti-semitic content on his website.”
Corey: I delete those immediately off my site.
David: Yeah. What is the modus operandi of these attacks? I think what people are having a hard time understanding is, this is not a free, open debate. Are they trying to get people to doubt any of this information? Is that basically what it is? They want to make it seem like it's not credible?
Corey: They'll put out misinformation to cloudy the water and make people doubt or make people think there's been inconsistencies. They'll put out full disinformation contrary to it, or they will just make . . . they will sit there and bait people into debates that turn into circular debates that frustrate people to where people are triggered and don't want to come back, or they just say “pfft to the whole thing”. I mean, there's a whole bunch of different scenarios and tactics that they use to manipulate and play with people's minds.
And they even go as far . . . If there are certain people that are strong supporters of a certain topic that they don't like, they'll begin to harass people, stalk them online, and even form alliances with real people and manipulate them into causing problems for the person as well. So they will manipulate other people that are of a similar mind to cause problems, as well.
So they're not just manipulating the people they disagree with. They'll find other skeptics, feed them information for them to say, “Oh, okay. I knew it.” And then they will take that misinformation and feed it further down the line. And I've seen a lot of that happening with bloggers that may have good intentions, but just have a certain point of view and then they receive information that they don't take the time to verify, and they just pass it along.
These days, honestly, anyone can open a blog or self-publish a book and or a YouTube channel. So a lot of these types of people can be compromised, as well.
David: Is it more useful to the Cabal if somebody gets into a highly charged emotional state, as opposed to if they're calm and rational?
Corey: Yes. Their goal is to throw you off. If you're calm, cool and collective and having a discussion in that matter, they'll try to get you into a circular debate until they trigger you and you lose it. And then they can say, “See, look at this person.”
David: Well, and now you can ruin your whole career with one tweet.
David: Less than 140 characters can just destroy somebody.
Corey: Right. You can ruin your reputation.
David: And there's always a digital footprint of everything you say online, no matter how charged you are, if you get blind with rage or whatever.
Corey: Right. These people are very clever. A lot of them will approach you and be real friendly even, and you will feel an affinity towards them and then pfft, they'll turn on you and something will post some information you shared with them.
David: So like will they feed your ego and boost you up and make you feel really important?
Corey: Right. You've got to be very careful with people that are telling you you're special and boosting your ego, telling you how important your work is, and that kind of thing. It's nice to hear, but you've got to be careful.
David: I noticed at the very beginning of my career that some of the people who wrote me the most complex and complimentary emails, if I then answered them, that they could turn very quickly and go from really, really praising me to being extremely angry and upset and negative.
Corey: I have been shocked at the number of people that I thought were friendlies that turned on me [snaps fingers] because I didn't answer their Skype. I got busy and didn't answer their Skype in a certain amount of weeks or whatever, and then poof.
Corey: So, you know, some of it is just personality, people out there that are just being people, but the data centers that we set up were absolutely for the purpose of targeting people out there that were putting out information, and also to locate these people and report them up the chain so action could be taken against them.
David: Well, let's remind the viewer that Glenn Greenwald, after leaving “The Guardian”, made his own website called 'The Intercept”. And there's a very complex series of Snowden documents that he's released on “The Intercept” documenting how they do this and showing flow charts and action plans of how these agents would attack this stuff, what things to say. And there were even examples in the documents, the Snowden documents, of like a seagull that's taken as it's flying fast so there's motion blur on the image of the body, and it kind of looks like a saucer.
Now, that picture is in there without any commentary, but it seems pretty clear, if you kind of connect the dots, that UFO forums were one of the things they were infiltrating.
Corey: Oh, yeah. The esoteric UFO forums and political and different non-governmental organization forums are their main targets.
David: Right before the Snowden documents came out, people might remember that there were other things starting to leak, and one of them was – this was just a few days before Snowden – that folks from the Tea Party were getting unnaturally audited at a much higher rate from the IRS than people that were not. Did they have the power to do stuff like that? Can they go after you through various corporate means, including taxes or maybe health insurance or your job?
Corey: Once you're reported up the chain and you're put on any number of lists, then you're open game to be targeted in any number of ways. If you're seen as a threat and you're put on one of these government threat lists, which undoubtedly you and I are definitely on, and a lot of people are on [the lists] that follow a lot of this information, especially if they're outspoken, they're definitely on lists, and things like that can occur.
David: When I first tried to open a bank account for my website as a company, I was told I had to create an LLC for tax purposes.
Corey: Yeah, I did too.
David: The bank, there was people that did a review before they'd give me the bank account, and this is just a simple bank account, nothing special. And the lady thought she was all smart and types in “David Wilcock” on Google, and the first thing that comes up below my name is “David Wilcock fraud” on Google. “Oh, well, he must be a fraud.”
And then I went back to them and I said, “Do you realize that I've written two New York Times bestselling books, and I'm on the number-one rated show on History Channel?” “Ohh!”
And I said, “Look, tell her that everybody in my field . . . this is what happens. There's a lot of people out there that don't like controversial information.” I just left it at that. So this stuff is real. People need to be aware. And were you just brought in for a week as a consultant for this job or was this just something you had for a longer period of time?
Corey: You're usually brought in to do virtualization. I was brought in to set up the virtual environment, to help the people with their workstations, get set up learning how to navigate their new virtual environment that was set up that me and some other people set up. And then after that, we moved on.
David: So you have a matrix of six screens, probably three on top, three on the bottom?
David: And then with the VMWare, each screen is a virtual machine in some different part . . .
David: . . . of the world so the IP address looks like they live in a different area?
David: And then they're working all these screens at the same time to have arguments with each other?
Corey: At times, yes. They'll sit there and argue with their self – with these alternate ego personalities – or they'll just be into multiple forums at the same time, causing problems, waiting for other people to respond, go to this one, say a few things, you know, kick the hornet's nest over here, go back to the other forum, hit refresh, see what happened – that kind of thing.
David: This is probably going to upset and annoy some people, make them pissed off. What can be done about this? Is maybe spreading the awareness and you coming forward with this, validating what the Snowden documents said on “The Intercept”, Glenn Greenwald's website? Is that part of the process?
And also, I guess, what's the best way to handle this if you think somebody is doing this online? Should you argue with them? Should you try to expose them?
Corey: Just being aware that that is occurring is the first step. Second step – and I've been guilty of it myself; it's hard not to sometimes – do not engage them. Ignore them. Pretend you didn't even see what they said. That drives them crazy. But just don't get into a circular debate. If you talk to a person and it looks like it's going into a circular debate, they're stuck. They're going to just reargue, reargue, reargue a moot point, then just move on.
David: What did they see that it is in the human psyche that makes us . . . We could get 100 positive emails, but we'll go for the one that's negative and focus in on that, or we'll see 100 positive discussions on a forum, and one person is a hater and we've got to attack that person? What is the vulnerability in us, and how can we heal that vulnerability so that we're not wanting to engage in these conflicts?
Corey: It is a part of human nature that we always focus on the negative. But also, it goes back to the personality profiles, and them knowing your weak spot. If they found that you don't like . . . If you're uncomfortable with the way your chin looks, they'll focus on your chin kind of a thing.
David: Do you think it's advisable for people to spend more time cultivating real friendships in the real world?
David: Because I've never had somebody talk to me in person, in all the years I've done this, over 20 years . . . In all the years I've been doing this, I've never had somebody speak to me in person with anywhere near the degree of disrespect that . . . If I read all the comments and emails that are out there per day, I could probably find 10 or 20 that are like that.
Corey: No one is the way they are in person when they're on the Internet. Even if they say, “I'm always this gruff. I don't care.” Some of the people, yeah, I guess that's true, but for the most part, even the nicest old lady, when they have the anonymity of the Internet and their power to say whatever they want, they're going to bang out some stuff here and there. And the power of the anonymity of being on the Internet and being able to make comments that you wouldn't do face-to-face normally, it's not the best way to meet people.
I've known a lot of people that have met their soulmates on dating sites. I'm not going to knock that, but Internet forums are heavily, heavily, heavily compromised by both troubled people and paid government trolls. So I don't even go to them any more. They are extremely compromised.
David: If somebody does want to try to spread the truth and they feel like some people are not listening to the truth, what are some positive things people can do to help spread this message? Should they be fighting somebody if that person just doesn't get it? Should they try a little bit and then back off? What are some positive ways to try to combat this influence and get the truth out?
Corey: Well, speak to those who are willing to listen. You're not going to be able to convince someone, so move to those who seem interested and want to know more. Don't waste your time on the person that's going to just want to argue with you. It's a waste of time.
David: I think that's a good point for us to end this episode on. This is “Cosmic Disclosure”. I'm your host, David Wilcock. We'll see you next time, and I thank you for watching.